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Massad Ayoob is a renowned firearms expert with decades of experience in the firearms community. Hes talking about drawing, thumb-cocking the hammer, and using it as SA. Striker pist ols simply don't offer this advantage. Im saying this safety has nothing to do with manual safeties, or with decockers. I appreciate being ready to fire immediately, but I dont understand this entire long trigger pull is safety argument. If you have any questions about the right way to handle or care for your firearms, our knowledgeable staff are here to help. These odd creatures exist. Absolutely love my CZs, Got 3; a 75B SA, a P01, and a PCR that is my EDC. Fact: DA trigger pull is still minute of bad guy accurate, and most people dont need anything more than that. This post was originally published at Fortress Defense Consultants. The hammer and the trigger move forward at the same time, and the same function that prevents the gun from discharging if the hammer is struck keeps the hammer from hitting the firing pin. Most anyone sounds like a near-absolute to me. Why? Regardless, never cared much for inserting my thumb between the hammer and slide on my 1911s if I had to decock for some reason but again, practice. $200 for it, or Enhanced Warranty. Options mean potential confusion under stress. Going to move it up next to wanker rails. 35, you have it labeled Beretta 92F, hammer down, trigger forward.. Cooper also came up with stupid ideas like the scout rifle. How to safely decock a rimfire pistol without damaging it - YouTube But thats just me. If you are an amateur who hasn't gotten around to learning the ins and outs of pistol usage, we strongly encourage you to take the time to learn how to use a pistol safely. Just the good shooters, effective shooters, and most instructors. Besides that the DoD frowns upon the use of military rank for commercial purposes which Guns & Ammo certainly was unless it is clearly stated that the person is retired. Transition to new platform was a cinch, jack round in chamber press lever down, holster, no safety! That sucker made a bang you could here on the entire floor! Between the DA trigger pull and having proper holsters that cover the trigger and trigger guard, the safety becomes an unnecessary redundancy. Nam risus ante, icsque dapibus efficitur laoreet. Generally, de-cockers come in two flavors: Single-Stageand Two-Stage. A tap/rack drill does not change the shooting grip, and it gets rid of a potential dud round (far more likely than a hard primer). Manually decocking semi auto pistols. : r/guns - Reddit The Sigs DA first round, or thumb cocked SA, is the safety, as the same actions are on a revolver. Logs can be taken lightly. Make sure each round is fully seated in the magazine. As others state, it isnt very hard at all to do, and you can practice it dry fire, pulling once with hammer down, and then cocking the hammer for the SA portion of the stroke. No problem with it. Being a trainer and dealing with people learning and being a competitor are two distinctly different worlds and neither applies across the board. And I dont recall the part of the safety rules that says Dont point it at anything you dont want to destroy, unless its a DA/SA, then its totes cool to do so. Its called capitalism. Draw pistol from holster, support hand grasps slide in proper manner (serrated areas on slide), slide is pulled back till it stops, and then released (do not ride the slide). It comes down to a reliable weapon and solid training more than anything else. If you carry cocked and unlocked (I.e. If, as one old gunwriter used to say, The purpose of shooting is hitting, then carrying a DA/SA pistol should be nearly last on your list of pistol choices. Live The Armory Life. My 1911s and Hi-Power had neither a double action mode nor a decocker, action of either is single action with safety. Even. Wasting time pulling the trigger on a round that is not likely to fire is not solving your problem that the pistol was pulled to solve. I have a p89 that I purchased in 92. Did you make that up, because anyone who follows competitive pistol shooting knows czs dominant production class. i spazzed the first time i threw the safety off of a pa63- the hammer fell and i thought it was broken. Pellentesque dapibus efficitur laoreet. The latest content straight to your inbox plus an automatic entry to each of our monthly gungiveaways! My first semiauto was a Sig P229, after 30 years carrying revolvers, and I loved it *because* it used the same safety plan as a revolver, no safety on the gun except the DA pull, just like a revolver, then SA until decocked. Decock. The views Pretty broad comment. We know after the Polish Army adopted the Radom, FN assisted them with establishing a factory to produce it. Gawd, I love these articles. Chambered aand ready to fire, no safety on, DA trigger pull on first shot, SA trigger pull on subsequent. Unload all the guns before storing them away and load them when preparing for. Always do it that way. I already voided the lifetime warranty by stripping the slide and polishing it. Wouldnt trade them for anything. Well they did have some but not enough that you read much about them in primary sources. My wife loves her Beretta 92, and really won;t carry anything else. It wasnt until a century later that the concept of training like Jerry Miculek so you can make 400 yard shots with a J-frame in DA with the pist ol held upside down and using your pinky finger on the trigger became a thing. I took a course once from an ex-cop who said he always carried a 1911 style with the chamber empty and the hammer down (Is that Israeli carry?) The comments afterwards make me feel warm and fuzzy. If youre already superb with a DA/SA.wait, never mind. This was my first handgun purchase and my only handgun for years. Unload all the guns before storing them away and load them when preparing for. They require an initial press downward to de-cock. Sure doesnt apply to *MY* Glock! Pressing the button will be enough to decock the firearm. That was comforting. Really? All is says it PT24/7 including the Pro. What led me to DA/SA pistols was a post I read that was written by a retired NYPD police officer. A lot of this comes from the fact that the gun is often carried with the hammer cocked, which might appear intimidating to some shooters. Best know your firearm before you need it. Next, I modified my quick-draw technique to allow for the long trigger pull to overcome the decock and decided it was an advantagein that the first shot would get the opponent moving and once I knew which way he was moving the next several shots without the decock would be taking that into account. In all honesty, many police departments, etc, look for a cheap reliable gun (e.g. Heavier yet smooth pull and a single trigger feel that doesnt change from shot-to-shot. A Glock CAN have a heavier pull, and I explained how, above. Cooper never did this of course because he wasnt a colonel and he wasnt retired military. Decocking the 1911??? | 1911Forum If you never use the decockers or the external safety on a DA/SA pistol, then it is exactly like a glock. but dont know how to operate them. I think the author is confusing Double-Action and Single-action triggers, and guns equipped with de-cockers. Decocker vs Manual Safety: Which Is Best? - USA Carry Exercise caution: Pick the pistol up with your dominant hand and point the muzzle in a safe direction. The Viz is far from the first. In fact, you never actually have to use the decocker. All this article said to me in summary, is the author doesnt like safties or decocker and wants me to believe that using them is a safety hazard. Manufacturers needed something marketable that resembled the Hi-Powers operating system, yet didnt invite lawsuits. I much prefer it to using a manual safety, which can easily be forgotten.. To help you out more, follow these steps to help you clear and store a pistol more carefully: To do this, release the magazine and slide the chamber back to pop the bullet out from the ejection port. Try this on your toy by holding the loaded gun in your left hand, pointed in a safe direction, and then flicking your right trigger finger across the trigger until the hammer falls. . Safeties are something to remember, & during a FOF moment you do not want to take the millisecond to have to remember to turn it OFF before engaging the Enemy/Intruder & can get you killed. When I finished, I gave the seat a good slam, forgetting that all seats are not created equal. The thumb safety added nothing to the safety of 1911s in case the gun was dropped. A Glock CAN have a heavier pull, and I explained how, above. I like my CZ-75D PCR. Its a lot better than a 1911 where you have to draw the hammer back before firing, or a Glock thats always at a 5lb trigger without any manual safety. Weve got the appeal to authority fallacy. You just point and shoot just like a glock. obviously, lowering the hammer on a live round aint for everybody. And now Ill ask you again for the list of professional trainers that endorse the carry of cocked and unlocked SA or DA/SA autopistols. Provided of course the first shot was planned. Most da/sa guns have a trigger/hammer block safety (which means the trigger must be pulled back and depressed to align the hammer to the firing pin) similar in function to the glocks trigger safety. In fact, it is actually advantageous when there is a struggle over the gun. sque dapibus efficitur laoreet. How could I comfortably call myself a CZ fanboy otherwise? People seeme to overlook the fact that we are smarter now from looking at what some smart people came up with back then. Donec aliquet. After the first shot, the slide will cycle and automatically cock the hammer for the next shot, resulting in a shorter, lighter second trigger press. Doesnt matter, it works fine. I CCW a decocked P07, so I shoot the same system in competition. If there's a key to doing this, it's doing so slowly and carefully. With proper safety precautions and simple guidelines, loading your pistol should be smooth sailing. But you say the Beretta Safety lever is a De-Cocker? In fact Mr. Brownings personal 1911 doesnt even have a thumb safety. Except many of them, Glocks etc, are carried cocked and unlocked, since there is no safety. Cocked and unlocked is the way to describe them. My point is that POTG should not just know how to run the gun they own. Striker fired pistols suck!!! The first shot is going to be long and heavier, but will prevent an unintentional discharge if you pull your gun during a stressful situation. In fact the Beretta 92 was my first gun back when I didnt know poop from shinola. We have fired thousands of rounds and experienced zero negligent discharges, and not even one incident that I would describe as a near negligent discharge! With the first shot, the operator manually cocks the hammer by pressing the trigger, for the following shots, the slide function re-cocks the hammer. Take a close look folks, this is what happens when someone who thinks they know what theyre talking about goes to Wikipedia to reinforce their mistaken beliefs. You should be able to run to the fallen cop, grab whatever is in his holster and run it. Arts & Humanities Writing CIS 311. The decocker allows the hammer to be lowered without the firing pin safety being disengaged. including messages sent by autodialer. Im not sure if thats great long term without a flag or dummy round in place. So far every time the Scot Terror alerts in the house I am up and rolling, pistol on fire, finger outside guard. you consent to receive marketing text messages Put aside all the fancy moves you may have seen in movies and let's dive in! Im used to external-hammer pistols with external safeties that can be decocked easily, but of course thats not possible with this pistol. Couldnt disagree more with this article. You never elaborated on that. Holstering the 1911 as shown in the accompanying picture, with thumb on hammer, ensures the grip safety is engaged and the gun cannot discharge even if the shooter has neglected to push the thumb safety upward into the on-safe position. Using the decocker takes the trigger from the light 4lb to a stiffer 9lb. Invest in a. Score 1. or an M&P 380 Shield, very often, new gun owners get irresponsible with their brand-new handguns. If all you want is a heavier trigger pull to make negligent discharges less likely, get a Glock and install a NY-1 or NY-2 connector, and youre good to go. the sig p22x decocker is a positive release you have control of the hammer through the decock lever the whole time . sig p22x series have a firing pin block that only gets lifted if the trigger is pulled. . Yes, by treating it as an SA gun with the hammer down. This is also the case with the well-regarded Smith & Wesson third-generation family of pistols. Problems often arise when you are not familiar enough with your chosen pistol and dont recognize its strengths and weaknesses. Ride the hammer as well. Colonel (telephone colonel) before he was drummed out. Guide for proper pistol decock Maintain the gun's sight in a safe direction. True. Id never had a pistol like that before and, at first, thought it was pretty weird. arrow pointing to de-cocker: Click to expand. Follow through is squeezing the trigger all the way back and holding it. Even if he had made the rank he wasnt entitled to use it since he did not retire but was drummed out. FNP-9 is another one; push the lever down, hammer drops, lever pops back up (not act as a safety). B. Under stress and in imperfect conditions, you are far more likely to find your pistol in the condition of readiness that you expect if you have trained consistently in that manner. This requires the slide to be racked with the support hand, which may not always be available for the task; one-handed slide-racking can be extremely slow and awkward compared to the simple draw-safety off-fire sequence of Condition One. But ultimately I found that my own thumbs made it hard for me to work them easily. To help you out more, follow these steps to help you clear and store a pistol more carefully: After reading this write-up, you should have a good understanding of how to load, discharge, and clear your pistol safely. The gun is carried with the hammer down. My Sig SP2022 has the de-cocker and is DA/SA. Decocker 101 | Personal Defense Network Ha ha. Civilian usage can vary. > DA on first round (Decocked!) If theyd have bought a M&P or Glock right out of the gate, they wouldnt be singing the (highly limited) praises of this out-of-date design. Place a weak hand finger or thumb in front of the cocked hammer, wedging it between the hammer face and the frame of the gun. So youre absolutely wrong on that point. What major training issues arise from it? Theyre like the people who call all semiauto pistols a Glock. I guess it worked on me though oh Weill homo!!! Agreed! I agree with you (said earlier) that they need to pick a method and stick with it. A simpleton and naive remark for a complex subject. Two Stage de-cockers are usually a lever (not a button). She did no worse than the any of striker monkeys and better than most. If it does, I want it to be as easy and accurately perforated as possible. Guns are like everything else. Just because its tougher for you, personally, to train people whose guns have a decocker, doesnt mean having a decocker or a DA/SA pistol is a bad idea. I trust my fingers more than I trust mechanical devices. HK (top) and SIG Sauer pistols with frame-mounted decocking levers. Their firing pin is free-floating so there is no firing pin block unless the safety/decocker is engaged. Press the "magazine release" on the handgrip to eject the magazine. Fire. Often, handgun enthusiasts fail to take correct care of their pistols, which hurts the quality of the pistol in the long run. neat! Yes, I know all the mantra about the human being the final safety, the gun is not at fault the person is, etc. etc. On the Beretta, the de-cocking lever doubles as a manual safety. Only people who have a rudimentary understanding call it a Radom. and you arent comfortable with running it without a training period youre doing it wrong. She is very proficient at drawing and cocking the hammer for the first shot rather than making the long DA pull. A repetitive passage here: and opinions expressed on this website are those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect the Many different factors go into discharging a Pistol. Access to over 100 million course-specific study resources, 24/7 help from Expert Tutors on 140+ subjects, Full access to over 1 million Textbook Solutions. DA/SA semi-autos tend to have a heavier and more inconsistent pull, (not sure why, the rev olver has to do the extra work of rotating the cylinder with that trig ger stroke. You can uncock pistols with hammers by holding the hammer and pressing the trigger then let the hammer back down slowly. I just dont see the hate. Are they accurate under deliberate slow-fire conditions? However, 85 percent of the guns students show up with fall into the polymer, striker-fired category. To return the pistol to its safe state, it is necessary to uncock (decock) the hammer, usually by holding the hammer spur, carefully pulling the trigger, and then slowly lowering the hammer on the firing pin. Then the user must manually return the lever to its starting position, to re-enable the firing mechanism. JavaScript seems to be disabled in your browser. Most of the work at hand. Now true, Ive only had a chance to dry fire it, but I much preferred the DA mode to the SA mode. 2. Anyway, it has a decock lever. He went on to point out that at the time he worked the NYPD had three choices for service weapons, Sigs DA/SA pistols, a version of S&W DA/SA pistols and Glocks. I just do not understand the issue. by Mike V. | Concealed Carry, General EDC. Glock leg is in large part an urban legend, like HK hates civilians. removed; this includes revolvers and semi-auto pistols. Carry it that way. http://excellentkeylogger.com More Information Whether you are looking to download for yourself. As a recent convert from wheel guns I love my CZ! Nam risus ante, dapibu, Explore over 16 million step-by-step answers from our library, molestie consequat, ultrices ac magna. Consistently, my objection to them is the heavy trigger pull in DA mode. De-cocker style guns were common during the 70s, 80s, and 90s. If people like them, goody for them because it means absolutely nothing to me. Copyright 2022 Ammunition Depot, ALL RIGHTS RESERVED, Unleashing the Firepower of John Wick 4: The Top Featured Guns and Ammo, Florida Becomes the 26th State to Adopt Constitutional Carry, Gear Review: Rattlesnake Tactical Medium Range Bag, Gun Review: Springfield DS Prodigy - Part 2, How to Transfer Ownership of a Gun: State by State, Best of the Best, September 2022 Gun Giveaway (CONTEST ENDED). Pick one, train and practice with it until you can use it safely and proficiently. Consent is not a condition of any purchase. - When firing is complete, the pistol needs to be "de-cocked" in order to render it relatively safe before holstering. Ill keep my DA/SA pistol with no frame safety, thank you too much! I wont have a striker fired pistol, except for perhaps .25 autos, de-cocker style operating systems suck. 2. Beretta always gave me problems. The writer of this article is a complete moron. This step-by-step guide will help you understand how to load, discharge, and clear a pistol safely. Im just content which you embraced this useful details around. > No safety on chambered ready to fire, no safey on, SA trigger pull on all shots. To decock a pistol safely and easily, [ you should: KEEP THE HANDGUN POINTED IN A SAFE DIRECTION; Enable the safety if available; Use the decocking lever if available; Place non-dominant hand thumb between hammer and firing pin. ] Secondly, decockers will not slow you down if you train with them and for those that feel safeties of this type are not need because your trigger finger controls everything start researching details about how grommets on jackets, lipsticks in purses, and other objects have been trigger fingers without a brain not to metion all of inexperienced CCW holders and poorly trained police out there who have died or injured themselves or others from accidental discharges with no safety striker fired pistols. I like having a hammer that I can put my thumb over while re-holstering, ensuring that even if something snags the trigger, the gun cant discharge. Look, all systems have compromises. I too have always felt that the long D.A. The Sig P226/227 for example use a SA/DA trigger with a decocker lever. In fact, it is very powerful monitoring software for parents with a warranty that lasts for 3 days. This author seems to have a its not what Im used to, therefore it sucks mentality. For those of us that own/shoot/carry hammer-fired pistols, we occasionally find ourselves in a position where manual decocking is called for. It truly is a classic nice and helpful piece of information and facts. C. Safely unload the pistol then utilize the slide lock or hammer blocking method. Safe. Training and practice will be required to prevent perforated legs, regardless of platform. Both are drop safe. Decocking a P220 Elite 10 SAO. | SIG Talk Its ALWAYS easier to learn one task (how to manage a single trigger pull weight and movement) than it is to learn two (a long/heavy first-shot pull, followed by a short/light second- and subsequent-shot trigger pulls). . Your Glock sucking opinion is meaningless. S&W, SIG, H&K, Walther and Ruger (among others) produced vast quantities. Consider storing the container in a discreet place, far away from kids and anyone you don't wish to see around your firearm. They all have their pros and cons. It really is an extra. If you want to render it safe without the decocker, you can eject the mag and rack the slide just like you would a glock. Crossbow Shooting Frequently Asked Questions - BowScanner The Walther manual is a little vague on several points, and says to just clear the chamber and pull the trigger. All DA should have De-Cockers It will be a Determining Factor when I purchase a Pistol. This was the first gun I ever owned with a de-cocker. Unfortunately, unlike the people of the old west, the APs & SPs would forget which way the cylinder turned and an AD was often the result. He was against it because condition 1 carry was with the hammer back and the public perception was that the pistol was cocked and dangerous. Fast forward my Nephew said I should try the SIG as that is what he used in the service! The Ruger P-series guns use a different shaped lever to help distinguish the two systems more readily. Hed sold the patent rights on the 1911 to Colt, and they werent due to expire till 1928. I bought one of the first Glock 17s in the country, easy pistol to use, mushy trigger, definitely needs to be holstered with a trigger guard if loaded. Just like you have to train to make damn sure your Glocks chamber is empty before you try to strip it. De-cocking lever is down, requiring manual movement up to re-enable the pistol. Either youre ready to shoot or not. Think how happy my Sig DA/SA with decocker made me! keylogger Ucuz veya cretsiz izleme yazlm kullanmayn! They will remain with us. Agreed. Until you forget to decock after use, and prior to holstering (which most instructors on serious training ranges have seen more than once). Yes, by treating it as an SA gun with the hammer down. The photo of the wz. Thank you. my Beretta 8045 the decocker has been worked till it is as easy as a normal manual safety. [Solved] To decock a pistol safely and easily you should: A. Use a Sure, its easy to remember how your pistol is configured right after youve dropped it into your holster. I got lucky in 1984 when I bought my first plastic gun, the SIG P226. To each his own. Decocker-equipped pistols are found worldwide in police and security service. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. How To Carry a DA/SA Pistol - Concealed Carry Setup Advantages Should Taurus add decocking functionality the G2C and G3 I love my old Israeli police trade-in Jericho that is marked IMI rather than IWI. [URL=http://Excellentkeylogger.com/ keyloggers [/URL It is definitely not without its dangers and temptations. My backup was a S&W 442 because of the DA only trigger and light weight. This answer has been confirmed as correct and helpful. Proper storage usually requires that the firing chamber be empty and. With drop-safe construction such as Springfield Armorys, the cocked-and-locked 1911 is perfectly safe. Different but again, train what you carry, no? (If you intend to keep the weapon loaded for self- or home-defense, make sure you store it safely for that purpose.) Right, because the gun is responsible and not the user, is that what youre saying? I transitioned to semi pistols from revolvers in 1986 when I got a Sig P-226. Well, whatever the difference is in terminology but yes, either decocking the hammer or lowering it safely to virtually the same spot in rest while the weapon is loaded. (OK, thats a bit of an exaggeration, but). As I read the article, where the author claims that decocker levers have to be thumbed downward to activate and then thumbed back upwards to render the pistol active again, I thought to myself Whoa, that sounds unnecessarily complicated. The CZ decocker lets you thumb it to drop the hammer back into DA, and thats it. How To Decock A Striker Fired Pistol? - Patriot Outdoor News Ha-ha! Or you dont have to use it at all. Press down and slide one round at a time under the feed lips of the magazine. are doing just fine, my guess is that the market doesnt think like the author does. I learned to shoot with DA/SA weapons and spent time in the NAVY shooting with SEALS who all carried Sigs with decockers, your silly opinions are meaningless and you have no business teaching anyone how to handle a firearm. Doing mag dumps this way I easily keep all shots, including the first, on target from standard self defense distances. Not 1911 but thats a hard standard to achieve. I couldnt find it. A glock will never have a heavy trigger pull on the first round and lighter thereafter and that is what I was talking about. In fact, I have a Canik C100 at Cajun Gun Works now that Ill use as my EDC when they finish with it. Oh goody, a sermon from a true-believer in the Church of Glock. I will agree you need to remember to flip the safety lever/de-cocker back to fire if it does double dutype as a safety. Great gun! Decock/safety works fine on my pistol, but I still ride the hammer down when switching the lever from fire to safe/decock. Yes, practice makes perfect and muscle memory, etc,etc. My conclusion is they dont work well for people with small hands or a weak grip. 1. If you have any questions about the right way to handle or care for your firearms, our knowledgeable staff are here to help. The US Air Force Air Police and Security Police, the essential ground combat arm and law enforcement agency of the USAF, used this method daily for the S&W K-15 .38 cal revolver for decades. I have two open carry holsters and I carry with the hammer cocked and locked because I have a strap over the firing pin to ensure it doesnt go off on the off chance of a mechanical failure. Interesting attitude! It blocks the hammer locking pin for moving and keeps so when you move the tigger locking pin to the moves it out. De-cocking lever is down, requiring manual movement up to re-enable the pistol. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. And putting in a Wolff spring has made the DA relatively light. With the first shot, the operator manually cocks the hammer by pressing the trigger, for the following shots, the slide function re-cocks the hammer. With just a downward press of the thumb on the manual safety, the pistol is ready to fire with its famously good trigger pull.